tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1546665963755719151.post1517684742360864809..comments2023-07-15T07:17:49.535-04:00Comments on Professional Wrestling in U.S. Popular Culture: Back on BarthesSam Fordhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17233749268141980625noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1546665963755719151.post-15397311157490439062007-04-26T16:38:00.000-04:002007-04-26T16:38:00.000-04:00Hi Kate, Here's the quote by Aristotle on 'spect...Hi Kate,<BR/><BR/> Here's the quote by Aristotle on 'spectacle' from the 'poetics' and please remember his is a description of tragedy, and not as the renaissance scholars mistakenly thought, a prescription!<BR/><BR/>Its not an exact translation, but its close enough!<BR/><BR/>"Spectacle depends more on the art of the stage machinist than on that of the poet"davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13332807776591087723noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1546665963755719151.post-48453284505558456922007-04-26T07:59:00.000-04:002007-04-26T07:59:00.000-04:00Thanks for the comments.. Laury, do get in touch i...Thanks for the comments.. Laury, do get in touch if you ever make it to Boston, it would be great to meet you at some point!<BR/><BR/>David, I hadn't considered the Aristotle tack... it's certainly interesting that plot comes first in that hierarchy, and spectacle last. (Especially since Barthes was looking at a spot show rather than serial wrestling stories, as Sam points out.)<BR/><BR/>'Stagecraft' seems a diminutive label for spectacle on first impulse... I'll definitely look at 'Poetics', thanks fo the reference!katejameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08430363581506455789noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1546665963755719151.post-51014358009988546242007-04-25T09:43:00.000-04:002007-04-25T09:43:00.000-04:00Kate, you raise a lot of interesting questions in ...Kate, you raise a lot of interesting questions in this post that I hope play a part in your continued research. Barthes is one of the first major scholars to take a look at pro wrestling, and so much that has followed him has taken that "spectacle of excess" approach as a foundation. <BR/><BR/>You raise interesting questions, though, about where Barthes' theory here grants autonomy and agency to the spectator. Barthes, after all, is the one who wrote of "the death of the author," so it is not outside his scope to consider the importance of a spectator-driven text. In his approach, though, he seems to believe wrestling has no ambiguity, that it has no subtlety. It's certainly very visual and over-the-top, but the subtlties come in a different sort of nuance, I think.<BR/><BR/>Another problem I've had with Barthes is that he was looking at the equivalent of an indy "spot show," a one-time show, rather than wrestling as a serial narrative. He writes about how every moment is immediately intelligible and disconnected from one moment to the next, but this defies both the "psychology of booking" Ole Anderson writes about, the serialized nature of pro wrestling shows, and the psychology of building the single match by telling a story.Sam Fordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17233749268141980625noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1546665963755719151.post-77386078500996489742007-04-24T19:33:00.000-04:002007-04-24T19:33:00.000-04:00Interesting tack on torture, and the reenactment t...Interesting tack on torture, and the reenactment thereof, as spectacle...I wonder what it means, though, if (as many of our theorists have argued, even if it's more problematic in the present) that the face--the innocent--is often the one on the receiving end?Beeznutshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16933308928180953131noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1546665963755719151.post-52346657848428056822007-04-24T18:40:00.000-04:002007-04-24T18:40:00.000-04:00Hi Kate! I enjoyed your comment! Just out ...Hi Kate! <BR/> I enjoyed your comment! <BR/><BR/> Just out of curiosity, have you considered the possibility that Barthes' use and meaning of the term 'spectacle' is mainly concerned with Aristotle's placement of it in his 'Poetics'!<BR/><BR/>I only bring it up because my students always mention in their papers and I thought it might help you in yours!<BR/><BR/>Aristotle's 6 elements of theatre in order of importance:<BR/><BR/>1-plot<BR/>2-character<BR/>3-thought<BR/>4-diction<BR/>-----------<BR/>5-song<BR/>6-spectacle<BR/><BR/>Aristotle places spectacle last because it relies more on 'stagecraft' than on writing!<BR/><BR/>Just a thought! good luck on your research paper!davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13332807776591087723noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1546665963755719151.post-50770671222204859022007-04-24T17:13:00.000-04:002007-04-24T17:13:00.000-04:00Kate, yes! I am so sorry we did not get to meet. ...Kate, yes! <BR/><BR/>I am so sorry we did not get to meet. I think we have similar theoretical concerns. I would have been glad to have the chance to chat in person. <BR/><BR/>Take careAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com