While watching the "Lipstick and Dynamite" documentary on the history of women in professional wrestling, there was one thing that struck me the most. Up until I watched that, the only things I had seen of Mae Young and Moolah were of them being old ladies driven through tables by the Dudley Boyz on Raw, or being caught making out with Bobby Heenan and Gorilla Monsoon backstage at Wrestlemania 20, or of them just being in disturbing segments (Mae Young with Mark Henry = disturbing). Then there were the cracks of The King about their age (my favorite was his remark that when David killed Goliath, Mae Young called the police), and that pretty much summed up the gist of everything I knew about Mae Young and Moolah.
What struck me was how little I knew about these two women and their contributions to wrestling, and how my view was tremendously skewed just by watching what the WWE has me watch every week. The fault is partly WWE's, but I think it lies more on Mae Young and Moolah than anyone else. I understand and find it admirable that they love the wrestling business so much that they want to remain a part of it for as long as they can, but at what expense are they doing this? For young fans who know nothing about their history, the only history they have to hang onto are the ridiculous segments that these two ladies agree on these days. Yes, sparingly is good, since they're not used all the time, but why bother at all? Mae Young and Moolah are old and have zero business being in a ring at their age, especially to just get mocked.
It's not just them either - it's something that we see so much of these days. Just tonight on Raw, Roddy Piper and Dusty Rhodes made appearances and were beaten down at the hands of Umaga. Roddy Piper himself recently had a match or two teaming up with Ric Flair, and Hulk Hogan makes an occasional wrestling appearance for "one last match." And Hulk was never that great as a wrestler (I agree on Lou Thesz's assessment of him), so to see him even trying to keep up with someone younger and quicker, it's just personally something I'd rather live without. The situation is even worse with Hogan because he always comes back and wins! Yes, we're not supposed to care about wins and losses, but do you guys think it's better that these old-timers keep popping up on occasion and getting into the ring, or should they just step away permanently, for the sake of preserving the memories of them as greats?
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I think you have to look at the old timers in two groups, Hulk Hogan and everyone else. With Hogan rules of logic, nature and economics don't apply so we'll let him slide.
With the rest, I think it comes down to two things: the need to make a buck and the desire to hear the cheers one more time.
At the WWE level, where the old-timers strike me as the kind who took care of their money, they're booked correctly. In the end, they're almost always left laying. And when they're not (Piper/Flair tag champs)the flurry of offense is short lived. I think this helps maintain reality and get the younger guys over. As has been widely reported, Flair needs the money, but once his financial situation is fixed I don't think he'll quit until someone forces his hand. I like seeing these guys pop up once in a while, because I grew up watching them, or I read about them in my Apter mags. They like to get the pop, it'll always be a part of them. I think seeking the pop is probably more important than the paycheck that comes with it to them.
On the indy level, it's a far bleaker animal. Most of the old-timers wrestling the indy circuit wouldn't get a cup of coffee for a cameo with the WWE. One well known former WWF belt holder told me once "I was a millionaire three times, and three times in went up my nose."
Backstage these guys can barely move and a lot keep to themselves, sometimes even asking for a seperate dressing room. At intermission they hobble out to take Polaroids, but unless you've got older people there, it's sad. I once took 2 pictures for Captain Lou Albano for a $10 total.
Most of these guys either burned their bridges too hard when they had a drug habit 15-20 years ago, or still have said habit. They're doing the only thing they know how to do, no matter how embarassing. Jimmy Snuka doesn't do the Superfly off the top rope anymore because a 63-year-old man just shouldn't. But, if these guys can still get $500 a show and get booked six or seven times a month, they can eke out a living, and that's better than poverty.
Eventually these guys won't get booked. Eventually the WWE cameo guys won't get booked. Time will move on and I think these guys are just trying to grab all the cash and glory they can until they can't anymore.
Nostalgia raises an interesting question, Carolina, and I think you make some substantial points. Certainly people have been booked on top way too late in their careers, and that is a negative. On the other hand, some wrestlers use their reputation to help build up a newcomer in some way or another, or else there's the nostalgia card that is good for a pop.
Remember that these wrestlers often don't have big pensions built up, and many don't have other careers to fall back on, so staying in the game is important to them. As Moolah and Mae say, they really don't have much else. The fact that they are known to the modern wrestling fan means the world to them, even if it is in a completely different light. I feel especially sorry for Mae because Moolah was always a WWE girl and they do show what she used to be like, but we've never seen any indication about Mae's long and storied career, partially because there's not much in the way of footage from her matches these days.
WWE does a decent job of keeping a balance on most legends and never booking them over younger guys, but I think this could be accomplished even more. The Flairs and Foleys and Hogans, when used selectively, can still be a draw. In Hogan's case, you can't insert him in the regular mix like Flair because he doesn't see himself as one of the boys, and honestly he loses his magic if he were booked this way, anyway.
As for the company's motivation, as WWE tries to promote their tape archive, WWE 24/7, DVD releases, autobiographies of legendary wrestlers, etc., bringing these guys back in makes sense.
I wonder why a few of them don't get signed back up for the old manager model. We have talked before about so many wrestlers not having a developed enough personality these days. Back in the 1980s and most of the 90s, they were just put in a stable with a manager who helped build their character for them. Some of these old-timers could still be used in that role, the Arn Andersons and Ted DiBiases of the world, if the writers wanted to book them that way again.
Having seen the 'Lipstick and Dynamite' documentary and an episode of 'Hogan Knows Best' within a day of eachother, what struck me about the old-timer ladies in the doumentary versus Hogan (who, I agree, is a whole other hyperbolic catagory) was the way that they talk about the performative elements of their careers.
Moolah spoke mostly in character, talking about the dramas and incidents of wrestling inside and outside in one train of thought. One gets the sense that the line between Moolah the wrestler and Moolah the woman is a fuzzy one, if it exists at all.
Hogan, though, enacted a scene like the one found in joshua's comment: he is hobbling around in his dressing room and holding family meetings about whether to continue his career at the expense of his health (oh, and he has a reality show- a wrestler with a reality show??!). Hogan in the ring is clearly a different character than Hogan the man.
I wonder if this continuity of character that allows Moolah's brand of nostalgia-generation avoid tipping into the pathetic for me. I liked watching her and Mae in the ring as old ladies. There's something fantastically empowered about it-- they are still capable of physical and performative prowess that defies their demographic.
Anyway, nostalgia is certainly a marketable thing, but whose responsibility is it to determine whether the demand for the old-timer is for the respectful, appropriate revival of the former champion, or if the cheers are for the joke of it all? Sam points out the ways in which the WWE tries to bring them back in a way that makes sense and with supporting material about their histories, which is good. But the wrestlers themselves and the managers should also know when to say enough.
I THINK HULK HOGAN WAS THE BEST ENTERTAINER NOT WRESTLER. EVERYONE KNOWS THAT. WHO CARES IF HE CAN'T RUN THE FASTEST OR HAVE THE BEST WRESTLING HOLDS. WHAT MATTERED WAS THAT HE SOLD OUT ARENAS EVERYWHERE AND HAD THE LOUDEST CHEERS EVER. NOW WHEN YOU SEE GUYS COMING DOWN THE AISLE YOU HARDLY HEAR ANYTHING. WRESTLERS NOW A DAYS AREN'T AS EXCITING! AND FOR ALL YOU HOGAN HATERS, HOGAN WILL ALWAYS BE NUMBER 1 WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT. JUST LIKE TRIPLE H SAID THERE WILL NEVER BE ANOTHER HULK HOGAN. SO QUIT HATING ON HOGAN HE WAS JUST TRYING TO MAKE A LIVING LIKE EVERYONE ELSE.
I THINK VINCE MCMAHON LOST HIS TOUCH ON WRESTLING. IT'S SO BORING NOW. THE STORYLINES SUCK. IT'S NOT INTERESTING ANYMORE. A BIG PART OF THAT IS BECAUSE WE'VE SEEN IT ALL ALREADY. THEY DO NEED TO BRING BACK SOME OF THE OLD GUYS BECAUSE IT MAKES FOR INTERESTING T.V. THE ONLY ONES WORTH WATCHING IS JOHN CENA, TRIPLE H, SHAWN MICHAELS, AND BATISTA. IF YOU GUYS WANT REAL ACTION, WATCH TNA WRESTLING! BETTER ATHLETES WITH BETTER MOVES AND BETTER STORYLINES! IF YOU WATCH ONE PROGRAM I PROMISE YOU, YOU WON'T BE DISAPPOINTED.
Poor old Hulk, just trying to provide for his family...Kidding aside, Hulk was absolutely one of the most popular guys in wrestling history, especially looking at those reactions in his prime. I wouldn't say that you hardly hear anything for wrestlers today, though. It seems the crowd's pretty noisy when John Cena's making his way down, for instance. Now, it might be a mixed reaction, but it's certainly a passionate crowd, one way or the other.
And I agree completely that bringing the familiar faces back is crucial, even if it's not in a wrestling capacity. Plus, with WWE 24/7 and the old archives WWE owns that fuels that VOD channel, they have every reason in the world to promote the past now.
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